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Post by gwyn on May 27, 2023 13:47:35 GMT
Ha ha, hilarious. Or maybe it's down to there being more demand in the domestic market. Why does the Guardian continually make itself look stupid by not investigating other obvious possibilities? Oh that's right, because it is a propaganda rag, not a newspaper. Shame on you posting posting tripe. Carl has always posted a lot of The Guardian, even back on real IMDb. I have a theory it's the subject of his signature. It's his wife now!
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Post by notoriousnobbi on May 27, 2023 19:14:28 GMT
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Post by notoriousnobbi on May 27, 2023 19:18:03 GMT
Carl has always posted a lot of The Guardian, ... Could it simply be that some important stuff isn't reported in the Telegraph and the Times and it's easily accessible on the Guardian website?
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Post by notoriousnobbi on May 27, 2023 19:59:16 GMT
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Post by notoriousnobbi on May 28, 2023 7:36:48 GMT
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Post by yggdrasil on May 28, 2023 11:34:07 GMT
Ha ha, hilarious. Or maybe it's down to there being more demand in the domestic market. Why does the Guardian continually make itself look stupid by not investigating other obvious possibilities? Oh that's right, because it is a propaganda rag, not a newspaper. Shame on you posting posting tripe. Nothing to do with The Guardian, they are just reporting (as are many other outlets) on Government figures and a report from chartered Accountancy firm "Hazlewoods". There will be many factors but pretending it's nothing to do with Brexit red tape is as silly as pretending it's all down to that, it's certainly a factor that make our exports less attractive, that's for sure. "The chartered accountancy firm Hazelwoods, which analysed the figures, blamed a number of factors including the risk to farmers who are selling fruit, which may end up rotting if delayed by customs or phytosanitary officials in Calais and other EU ports. But they also said that, with the delays and extra cost of fruit, retailers in continental Europe were now less likely to buy from the UK and were choosing to import fruit from other countries within the bloc. “Long delays at UK ports are dissuading many fruit farmers from sending their produce abroad,” said Rebecca Copping, a partner at Hazlewoods. “For a nation with an historic reputation for producing high-quality fruit, it’s a shame that red-tape is making it harder for farmers to export their wares.” “Even double-digit inflation hasn’t been enough to bring the value of fruit exports into the black. This shows just how much damage has been inflicted on the sector.” Analysis of HMRC data showed that the overall value of exports to the EU of food had increased but Hazelwoods said “a large proportion of this increase in value can be attributed to rising inflation in food prices, following the Ukraine crisis”. The different approach taken by the EU and the UK to checks has been the source of tension between the government and the British horticulture sector, with farming bosses accusing the government of giving European suppliers an unfair advantage over domestic producers. Brexit checks on food and animal products including unpasteurised cheese from the EU have been delayed four times by the British government and are due to start being phased in at the end of October."
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Post by Flying Monkeys on May 28, 2023 12:07:23 GMT
Ha ha, hilarious. Or maybe it's down to there being more demand in the domestic market. Why does the Guardian continually make itself look stupid by not investigating other obvious possibilities? Oh that's right, because it is a propaganda rag, not a newspaper. Shame on you posting posting tripe. Nothing to do with The Guardian, they are just reporting (as are many other outlets) on Government figures and a report from chartered Accountancy firm "Hazlewoods". It's everything to do with the Guardian because they only tell half of the story, creating an immediate feeling in the reader that something bad has happened. A drop in exports is not bad in itself - you need to see whether sellers' revenues have dropped as a result. That's what matters, not which market they are selling into. And if the domestic market has gone up so their revenues are stable, this is an absolute non-story and their positioning it as something bad is completely disingenuous and cannot be called 'reporting'. It is simple propaganda. So, do we have the full picture of overall revenues?
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Post by yggdrasil on May 28, 2023 13:00:45 GMT
Nothing to do with The Guardian, they are just reporting (as are many other outlets) on Government figures and a report from chartered Accountancy firm "Hazlewoods". It's everything to do with the Guardian because they only tell half of the story, creating an immediate feeling in the reader that something bad has happened. A drop in exports is not bad in itself - you need to see whether sellers' revenues have dropped as a result. That's what matters, not which market they are selling into. And if the domestic market has gone up so their revenues are stable, this is an absolute non-story and their positioning it as something bad is completely disingenuous and cannot be called 'reporting'. It is simple propaganda. So, do we have the full picture of overall revenues? Well, you have the growers stories about being in deep shit financially, but then that can be accused of just being anecdotal. There is also the well reported stories of fruit and veg rotting in the fields as we can't get the cheap foreign immigrant labour, now. Kind of a Brexit double whammy, you can't say neither of those issues are Brexit related without cognative dissonance.
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Post by Flying Monkeys on May 28, 2023 13:10:02 GMT
It's everything to do with the Guardian because they only tell half of the story, creating an immediate feeling in the reader that something bad has happened. A drop in exports is not bad in itself - you need to see whether sellers' revenues have dropped as a result. That's what matters, not which market they are selling into. And if the domestic market has gone up so their revenues are stable, this is an absolute non-story and their positioning it as something bad is completely disingenuous and cannot be called 'reporting'. It is simple propaganda. So, do we have the full picture of overall revenues? Well, you have the growers stories about being in deep shit financially, but then that can be accused of just being anecdotal. There is also the well reported stories of fruit and veg rotting in the fields as we can't get the cheap foreign immigrant labour, now. Kind of a Brexit double whammy, you can't say neither of those issues are Brexit related without cognative dissonance. I was thinking about actual numbers (facts), rather that stories, simply because people have agendas while data don't. HMRC would be the source I would go for.
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Post by yggdrasil on May 28, 2023 15:30:29 GMT
Well, you have the growers stories about being in deep shit financially, but then that can be accused of just being anecdotal. There is also the well reported stories of fruit and veg rotting in the fields as we can't get the cheap foreign immigrant labour, now. Kind of a Brexit double whammy, you can't say neither of those issues are Brexit related without cognative dissonance. I was thinking about actual numbers (facts), rather that stories, simply because people have agendas while data don't. HMRC would be the source I would go for. Well, they wouldn't release personal data, so that's an impossible ask. Let's be honest, even if they did and it proved it categorically you'd somehow find a way to blame "lefties".
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Post by Flying Monkeys on May 28, 2023 15:36:31 GMT
I was thinking about actual numbers (facts), rather that stories, simply because people have agendas while data don't. HMRC would be the source I would go for. Well, they wouldn't release personal data, so that's an impossible ask. I'm not suggesting personal data. But it's very easy for them to produce data that shows revenue by SIC code, before and after. Proved what categorically? Data just shows what happened, not why, so it wouldn't prove anything. That would be the next step - once you understand what happened, to figure out why. That's the grey area, of course - some will say Brexit, some will say inflation, etc. Must start with the data, though, and the Guardian doesn't because it has an agenda and should not be considered a newspaper. Plus, lefties.
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Post by notoriousnobbi on May 28, 2023 17:09:20 GMT
... Data just shows what happened, not why, so it wouldn't prove anything. That would be the next step - once you understand what happened, to figure out why. That's the grey area, of course - some will say Brexit, some will say inflation, etc. Must start with the data, though, and the Guardian doesn't because it has an agenda and should not be considered a newspaper. Plus, lefties. A part of your media is feeding the narrative that a lot of Brexit damage is happening bc of a Civil Service full of 'Remainer saboteurs'. So even if your official authorities publish data you will still be able to question that data. And ministers might try to bully civil servants fiddling with the definitions if the data doesn't show what is officially wanted. Not a Brexit story, but for a lesson in media awareness/literacy you might dig into the thread for comparing the Guardian framing with tabloid media framing. And look up the media you trust whether and how they reported in that case.
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Post by Flying Monkeys on May 28, 2023 17:13:51 GMT
... Data just shows what happened, not why, so it wouldn't prove anything. That would be the next step - once you understand what happened, to figure out why. That's the grey area, of course - some will say Brexit, some will say inflation, etc. Must start with the data, though, and the Guardian doesn't because it has an agenda and should not be considered a newspaper. Plus, lefties. A part of your media is feeding the narrative that a lot of Brexit damage is happening bc of a Civil Service full of 'Remainer saboteurs'. So even if your official authorities publish data you will still be able to question that data. Revenue by SIC code from HMRC cannot be redefined, though. The only way to change it is to publish false data.
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Post by Carl LaFong on May 28, 2023 18:02:11 GMT
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Post by Flying Monkeys on May 28, 2023 18:13:31 GMT
Let me guess, the Guardian's question was: "Given spiralling inflation, the food crisis, huge immigration and the energy crisis, do you think brexit has made things worse?" Something like that maybe?
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