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Post by Harold of Whoa on Feb 17, 2018 1:18:30 GMT
Assuming that you recognize that the NRA has strong political influence in the US (which seems to be the common wisdom on all sides), why do you think that is?
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Post by jojoplumlee on Feb 17, 2018 1:57:51 GMT
Assuming that you recognize that the NRA has strong political influence in the US (which seems to be the common wisdom on all sides), why do you think that is? Lobbyists (Money) |
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Post by Harold of Whoa on Feb 17, 2018 3:01:19 GMT
Assuming that you recognize that the NRA has strong political influence in the US (which seems to be the common wisdom on all sides), why do you think that is? Lobbyists (Money) I assumed that would be the primary response. As it turns out, that doesn't really explain it. The NRA spends a paltry amount in contributions to candidates compared to other political organizations, and they are really mediocre in the spending level for lobbying compared to the top political spenders. I can post links if you want, but it won't make you happy. Any other guesses? |
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Post by jojoplumlee on Feb 17, 2018 3:05:30 GMT
I assumed that would be the primary response. As it turns out, that doesn't really explain it. The NRA spends a paltry amount in contributions to candidates compared to other political organizations, and they are really mediocre in the spending level for lobbying compared to the top political spenders. I can post links if you want, but it won't make you happy. Any other guesses? You have some stats that I can review? |
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Post by Harold of Whoa on Feb 17, 2018 3:27:35 GMT
You have some stats that I can review? These are all from OpenSecrets.org. The NRA does not make the Top 50 list of organizational contributors to political campaigns.
In the 2016 election cycle, the NRA spent a paltry $1.1 m in direct campaign contributions, and $6.8 m on lobbying. For the same cycle, the AFL-CIO spent $19 m on candidates, and $10.6 m in lobbying. (And they are only one of about five big labor groups in the top 50.) Planned Parenthood gave $4 m to put candidates "in their pockets", and lobbied with $2.3 m. Money alone can't be the answer to NRA's influence level. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2018 3:36:17 GMT
Assuming that you recognize that the NRA has strong political influence in the US (which seems to be the common wisdom on all sides), why do you think that is? I think the NRA has influence in that they are the organization with top name recognition in the defense of 2nd amendment rights. They also report to have approximately 5 million members in the US (some sources day 14 million), which translates to a relatively big group of people for what they do. They are constantly quoted and maligned by the left for their positions and statements, but they also get the obligatory support from all Republican candidates during campaign season. Personally, I do support their base mission and I generally like the fact that they are out there as a vocal advocate for 2nd amendment rights, but I'm not a member and it's not like I check their website to see what they are up to these days (I never do). Fact is, the only thing I hear about the NRA comes from various news sources that bring them up.
Gun ownership is a core issue for Republicans. With the smaller estimate of 5 million members, likely most in red states, they are going to have influence toward policy and the platform of the GOP. I would venture to say that a lot of people pay the $40 for a yearly membership (I looked it up), because they do support the cause, they get a free magazine as a benefit and a decal!, but it not something they think about too often. So I think the influence comes from the fact that they built a large membership. It's a static voting block that carries weight in GOP policy. Actually, I think this has greater weight than the gun lobby, but sure, the people that make guns are going to be very interested in the primary group that supports gun ownership.
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Post by slowcomingwarbird on Feb 17, 2018 3:47:54 GMT
Assuming that you recognize that the NRA has strong political influence in the US (which seems to be the common wisdom on all sides), why do you think that is? Because of graft and corruption... Politicians receive money from special interest groups like the NRA and Koch Industries, and the oil companies so that politicians no longer represent the interests of the American people because that is contrary to the interests of the corporations and special interest groups. Politicians are afraid the corporations will stop giving them money if the American citizens are represented instead of the multinational corporations. In short, the politicians are afraid of losing their bribe money. Because representing corporations in foreign nations seems to be more profitable to politicians than doing what is best for the American citizens. We must vote to change that, so that American citizens are represented instead of big government contracts with multinational corporations. We must not continue to allow foreign nations to wage corporate and financial warfare against the American people. We must take action in this cyber war instead of only taking up a defensive position. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2018 4:04:40 GMT
Assuming that you recognize that the NRA has strong political influence in the US (which seems to be the common wisdom on all sides), why do you think that is? Because of graft and corruption... Politicians receive money from special interest groups like the NRA and Koch Industries, and the oil companies so that politicians no longer represent the interests of the American people because that is contrary to the interests of the corporations and special interest groups. Politicians are afraid the corporations will stop giving them money if the American citizens are represented instead of the multinational corporations. In short, the politicians are afraid of losing their bribe money. Because representing corporations in foreign nations seems to be more profitable to politicians than doing what is best for the American citizens. We must vote to change that, so that American citizens are represented instead of big government contracts with multinational corporations. We must not continue to allow foreign nations to wage corporate and financial warfare against the American people. We must take action in this cyber war instead of only taking up a defensive position. I agree with some basis of what you are saying, especially the part where you say "We must vote to change that, so that American citizens are represented instead of big government" (notice that I stopped just after the big government part), but as you would paint this picture, it would seem you think this graft and corruption only occurs on the right? Get real! I don't excuse it in either case. The left is just as embedded in (literally, in bed with) big money as the right, possibly more so these days.
And you say, "We must not continue to allow foreign nations to wage corporate and financial warfare against the American people.". Hasn't President Trump explicitly stated this very same thing?
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Post by Harold of Whoa on Feb 17, 2018 5:25:19 GMT
Assuming that you recognize that the NRA has strong political influence in the US (which seems to be the common wisdom on all sides), why do you think that is? Because of graft and corruption... Politicians receive money from special interest groups like the NRA and Koch Industries, and the oil companies so that politicians no longer represent the interests of the American people because that is contrary to the interests of the corporations and special interest groups. Politicians are afraid the corporations will stop giving them money if the American citizens are represented instead of the multinational corporations. In short, the politicians are afraid of losing their bribe money. Because representing corporations in foreign nations seems to be more profitable to politicians than doing what is best for the American citizens. We must vote to change that, so that American citizens are represented instead of big government contracts with multinational corporations. We must not continue to allow foreign nations to wage corporate and financial warfare against the American people. We must take action in this cyber war instead of only taking up a defensive position. So, not surprisingly, you and Trekker both either didn't read up-thread info or you are studiously ignoring it. Let me spell it out. The NRA ranks 488th out of 18,819 tracked political organizations in contributions to candidates, parties, party PACs, etc. 488th on the graft and corruption money scale. 488th in money spent to have candidates "in their pockets". Does their influence level seem 488th? If not, then graft and corruption doesn't explain their influence, otherwise it would be proportionate to the graft and corruption wrought by other organizations that spend more. Account for the discrepancy, please. |
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Post by jojoplumlee on Feb 17, 2018 5:56:21 GMT
Graft money is graft money. An undetermined amount.
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Post by scienceisgod on Feb 17, 2018 6:33:18 GMT
Graft money is graft money. An undetermined amount. Hillary spent 2 billion dollars and lost. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2018 6:48:16 GMT
Because of graft and corruption... Politicians receive money from special interest groups like the NRA and Koch Industries, and the oil companies so that politicians no longer represent the interests of the American people because that is contrary to the interests of the corporations and special interest groups. Politicians are afraid the corporations will stop giving them money if the American citizens are represented instead of the multinational corporations. In short, the politicians are afraid of losing their bribe money. Because representing corporations in foreign nations seems to be more profitable to politicians than doing what is best for the American citizens. We must vote to change that, so that American citizens are represented instead of big government contracts with multinational corporations. We must not continue to allow foreign nations to wage corporate and financial warfare against the American people. We must take action in this cyber war instead of only taking up a defensive position. So, not surprisingly, you and Trekker both either didn't read up-thread info or you are studiously ignoring it. Let me spell it out. The NRA ranks 488th out of 18,819 tracked political organizations in contributions to candidates, parties, party PACs, etc. 488th on the graft and corruption money scale. 488th in money spent to have candidates "in their pockets". Does their influence level seem 488th? If not, then graft and corruption doesn't explain their influence, otherwise it would be proportionate to the graft and corruption wrought by other organizations that spend more. Account for the discrepancy, please. Uh. I (Trekker) believe that was the first one who said that NRA influence came from their membership itself more than it did any moneyed lobby? Go back and look. I just didn't discount the fact that money was also coming in. |
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Post by drtokyo on Feb 17, 2018 8:11:05 GMT
I assumed that would be the primary response. As it turns out, that doesn't really explain it. The NRA spends a paltry amount in contributions to candidates compared to other political organizations, and they are really mediocre in the spending level for lobbying compared to the top political spenders. I can post links if you want, but it won't make you happy. Any other guesses? That's true. The NRA contributions are a pittance, but facts just get in the way of leftist BS assumptions. I don't give a crap about the NRA, but facts are facts. I'd say that many millions of US citizens like their guns and vote for politicians that support the NRA. |
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Post by jojoplumlee on Feb 17, 2018 20:00:18 GMT
Because of graft and corruption... Politicians receive money from special interest groups like the NRA and Koch Industries, and the oil companies so that politicians no longer represent the interests of the American people because that is contrary to the interests of the corporations and special interest groups. Politicians are afraid the corporations will stop giving them money if the American citizens are represented instead of the multinational corporations. In short, the politicians are afraid of losing their bribe money. Because representing corporations in foreign nations seems to be more profitable to politicians than doing what is best for the American citizens. We must vote to change that, so that American citizens are represented instead of big government contracts with multinational corporations. We must not continue to allow foreign nations to wage corporate and financial warfare against the American people. We must take action in this cyber war instead of only taking up a defensive position. So, not surprisingly, you and Trekker both either didn't read up-thread info or you are studiously ignoring it. Let me spell it out. The NRA ranks 488th out of 18,819 tracked political organizations in contributions to candidates, parties, party PACs, etc. 488th on the graft and corruption money scale. 488th in money spent to have candidates "in their pockets". Does their influence level seem 488th? If not, then graft and corruption doesn't explain their influence, otherwise it would be proportionate to the graft and corruption wrought by other organizations that spend more. Account for the discrepancy, please. Did we actually forget the money from the dun manufacturers themselves? |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2018 20:33:28 GMT
Did we actually forget the money from the dun manufacturers themselves? Earlier on, I said, "So I think the influence comes from the fact that they built a large membership. It's a static voting block that carries weight in GOP policy. Actually, I think this has greater weight than the gun lobby, but sure, the people that make guns are going to be very interested in the primary group that supports gun ownership."
The gun manufacturers are part of the gun lobby. Still, I side with others who have pointed out that there are lots of people who simply support the 2nd amendment. Most of these people in turn, are very responsible gun owners.
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