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Post by CrepedCrusader on Sept 16, 2023 0:17:59 GMT
Saw the question elsewhere and thought I'd pose it here.
For me, it was reading Frank Herbert's Dune and Robert A. Heinlein's Stranger in a Strange Land in my early teens. It made me realize that religion was just a bunch of stuff that people made up to achieve desired aims.
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Post by mikef6 on Sept 16, 2023 4:15:09 GMT
In high school, I got Saved. Yes, I was Saved, washed in the Blood. I wanted to become a Southern Baptist minister. My journey away from this started during University days when I discovered that religious people were judgmental and, often, not very nice people.
I married a Lutheran (from her Norwegian heritage) and we raised our two children in that tradition. I enjoyed their liturgical approach. However, what slowly did the trick over the years was cosmology, astronomy. The existence of billions of other galaxies like our own Milky Way. An infinitely large universe.
And the planet Earth? The one that the God creator of this vastness thought was special? Well, it is located in a more or less rundown neighborhood on the fringes of the Milky Way. As that Monty Python song goes:
Our galaxy itself contains a hundred billion stars It's a hundred thousand light years side to side It bulges in the middle, sixteen thousand light years thick But out by us, it's just three thousand light years wide.
We're thirty thousand light years from galactic central point We go 'round every two hundred million years And our galaxy is only one of millions of billions In this amazing and expanding universe
It is absurd – laughable – to think that Earth, humans, are anything but totally insignificant, part of an unbelievably massive natural environment. Compared to the scope of the Universe our planet – our lives and our deaths - even our galaxy are tiny to the point of meaningless.
But, hey. I’m cool with it. That’s just the way it is. I can’t do anything about it. So, sing and dance, watch movies, raise cats, have lots of loving sex, and enjoy what little you’ve got.
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Post by Meseia on Sept 16, 2023 6:25:52 GMT
Inconsistencies between what was taught in church and the bible. Also inconsistencies in the bible. The harder I tried to sort it out, the more I found and it all unraveled. By the end of my teens I was agnostic, took a while longer to rid myself entirely of almost 2 decades of brainwashing.
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Post by PaulsLaugh on Sept 16, 2023 8:13:35 GMT
Inconsistencies between what was taught in church and the bible. Also inconsistencies in the bible. The harder I tried to sort it out, the more I found and it all unraveled. By the end of my teens I was agnostic, took a while longer to rid myself entirely of almost 2 decades of brainwashing. And you think don't Muslims are brainwashed? Without their religion, do you think former Muslims can be less shitty?
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Post by PaulsLaugh on Sept 16, 2023 8:22:24 GMT
I think I was born skeptical, though I journeyed though the belly of the cockroach as an adult. My issue with religion began when my mother terrorized me once by telling me what would happen to me if I continued being a bad little girl, that is Hellfire and the Devil. Only a religion could cause an otherwise loving parent to do that to their child. It is not the faith, rituals, mythology, or even God or Jesus I object to, it is the hate, fear, and ignorance religions like Christianity and Islam spread.
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Post by Catman on Sept 16, 2023 11:11:41 GMT
Catman read the Bible.
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Post by CrepedCrusader on Sept 16, 2023 13:34:19 GMT
Disappointed there weren't enough cats?
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Post by mikef6 on Sept 16, 2023 14:03:41 GMT
What slowly did the trick over the years was cosmology, astronomy. The existence of billions of other galaxies like our own Milky Way. An infinitely large universe. And the planet Earth? The one that the God creator of this vastness thought was special? Well, it is located in a more or less rundown neighborhood on the fringes of the Milky Way. As that Monty Python song goes: Our galaxy itself contains a hundred billion stars It's a hundred thousand light years side to side It bulges in the middle, sixteen thousand light years thick But out by us, it's just three thousand light years wide.
We're thirty thousand light years from galactic central point We go 'round every two hundred million years And our galaxy is only one of millions of billions In this amazing and expanding universeIt is absurd – laughable – to think that Earth, humans, are anything but totally insignificant, part of an unbelievably massive natural environment. Compared to the scope of the Universe our planet – our lives and our deaths - even our galaxy are tiny to the point of meaningless. But, hey. I’m cool with it. That’s just the way it is. I can’t do anything about it. So, sing and dance, watch movies, raise cats, have lots of loving sex, and enjoy what little you’ve got.
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Post by stammerhead on Sept 16, 2023 16:29:56 GMT
The thing that's supposed to happen during my brief period of believing never seemed to happen to me. I was Holy Ghosted.
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Post by weststigersbob on Sept 16, 2023 17:46:03 GMT
Honestly - being born.
I have never been even remotely close to any sort of religiosity.
I have never had any sort of ‘supernatural’ experience in any way at all. People who claim they have, I assume are delusion, lying or mentally I’ll.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2023 14:16:42 GMT
It's a bit of a convoluted journey for me.
When I was a teenager, I started to question the Catholic faith I was raised in. I realised the things I believed were determined not by sound argument, but by circumstance - my Catholic father wanted me to be raised Catholic and so the Catholic schools I went to taught me Catholic beliefs as fact. Had my Protestant mother pushed harder, I probably would have taken Protestant beliefs as fact instead. And then had I lived in another part of the world, I probably would have been a Jew/ Muslim/ Hindu/ Shinto/ whatever instead.
I still believed in a God of some sort based on the rather simple notion of 'well, how can there be anything with no intelligence behind it?', but I pretty much felt I knew nothing about this God and I certainly didn't think Jesus was anything more than one of many preachers who in his case was just lucky enough that his cult caught on.
As I moved into my late teens and early twenties, I gradually gave up that belief in God as I figured religious cosmological answers were no better than natural. At this age, I was quite outspokenly atheist.
In my mid-late twenties, I had a few encounters with religious types who surprisingly had actually thought about the various philosophical objections to religion. I don't think any of them convinced me but they gave me food for thought though I remained quite resolutely atheist.
Then I studied a degree in philosophy which included a module on philosophy of religion and I was actually surprised by how robust some theist arguments were. Some of them even convinced me momentarily, but further investigation generally found them wanting.
I did however become more convinced that most theists and atheists were largely missing the point about religion - they were so focused on religious claims' explanatory power or lack thereof that they missed the psychological and emotional aspects of faith which are generally what drive people toward God rather than any supposedly logical proof. I became convinced that religious belief could be justified purely on faith and indeed justification by faith was the only legitimate reason to believe being particularly convinced by the likes of Kierkegaard and, a contemporary favourite of mine, Mary-Jane Rubenstein who I discovered accidentally on YouTube.
I have then toyed with trying to develop a faith myself in at times Hinduism, Christianity and, for one crazy weekend, Wicca. But ultimately I just haven't developed such a faith. So until I find such faith, I consider myself agnostic.
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Post by amyghost on Sept 19, 2023 16:03:15 GMT
Although I don't think I'd have been able to articulate this very well at the time, my own gradual--in fact still unwinding--journey to unbelief started with my prepubescent self being horrified at the notion that anybody I loved who was considered a sinner, or insufficiently a follower of The Faith, would be condemned to burn in hell forever, suffering eternal torment. And it was inferred that I, as one of the saved, was supposed to be happy about this! I honestly think much of Christian religious teaching, and specifically that aimed at the young, almost constitutes a form of child abuse...and as I got older, I found myself more and more rejecting Christianity as I encountered all too many followers who believed that many of the things I valued were inherently evil.
Couple that with the cultural Jewish heritage that was also a part of my upbringing (never adhered to the religious side of Judaism and still don't) and you end up with a surefire recipe for turning a young mind off the path of righteousness at a very early age ;).
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2023 17:21:08 GMT
Although I don't think I'd have been able to articulate this very well at the time, my own gradual--in fact still unwinding--journey to unbelief started with my prepubescent self being horrified at the notion that anybody I loved who was considered a sinner, or insufficiently a follower of The Faith, would be condemned to burn in hell forever, suffering eternal torment. And it was inferred that I, as one of the saved, was supposed to be happy about this! I honestly think much of Christian religious teaching, and specifically that aimed at the young, almost constitutes a form of child abuse. What always fascinates me about stories like this is they're so different from my experience where Hell and damnation were barely mentioned and the focus was very much on God's love. I imagine if my experience had been more similar to yours, I'd be a lot more hostile to Christianity than I am.
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Post by amyghost on Sept 19, 2023 17:28:46 GMT
Although I don't think I'd have been able to articulate this very well at the time, my own gradual--in fact still unwinding--journey to unbelief started with my prepubescent self being horrified at the notion that anybody I loved who was considered a sinner, or insufficiently a follower of The Faith, would be condemned to burn in hell forever, suffering eternal torment. And it was inferred that I, as one of the saved, was supposed to be happy about this! I honestly think much of Christian religious teaching, and specifically that aimed at the young, almost constitutes a form of child abuse. What always fascinates me about stories like this is they're so different from my experience where Hell and damnation were barely mentioned and the focus was very much on God's love. I imagine if my experience had been more similar to yours, I'd be a lot more hostile to Christianity than I am. I suspect that some of the fixation on the fire and brimstone side of it derives from Pentecostal and Southern Baptist beliefs. Although I only encountered the Pentecostalist version through a (brief) Sunday School class held by a neighborhood minister's daughter with whom I was--rather vaguely--friends, the SB portion came through Bible Class and Sunday worship when I'd attend with my grandmother. Not as fiery (pardon the pun) as the Pentecostal, the SB still had a plentiful attachment to the notion of hellfire, sin, and the punishments awaiting the unsaved, certainly equal to the amount of time and verbiage expended on God's supposed love and forgiveness.
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Post by general313 on Sept 19, 2023 17:33:59 GMT
For me it was science (the combination of biology, geology, astronomy, physics, and chemistry). I realized that the understanding of the world afforded by science doesn't have anything to do with the depiction presented in the Bible. That got me questioning the Biblical conception, to the point that I realised that there was no rational basis to accept any of it.
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