If Trump gets elected he will bring back Columbus Day

"I seriously doubt the Arawak Indians were cutting each others hands off when they returned to the village when they did not find any gold.

Nor slaughtered or enslaved each other as Columbus and his men did to the Indians."

Maybe more clarification was needed. I did not claim this against any specific tribe but rather... how Columbus' actions paled in comparison with the native American atrocities as whole which is well documented.

www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/genocide-slavery-and-rape-lets-remember-the-atrocities-of-indigenous-peoples 


"Harvard scholar Steven Pinker wrote that indigenous societies were “far more violent than our own.” In War Before Civilization: The Myth of the Peaceful Savage, anthropologist Lawrence Keeley wrote, “the dogs of war were seldom on a leash” among Native American societies.

Renowned historian Bernard Bailyn described pre-Columbian America as “not a terribly peaceful world. They were always involved in warfare.” Moreover, Bailyn describes how Native Americans sought to control and exploit Europeans for their own gain and self-interest.



“The Indians had the view they wanted to use [the Europeans]," he writes. "They wanted the English there on the fringe so they would have the benefit of their treasure, their goods, even their advanced weapons. They wanted that, but under their control.”



In other words, many Native Americans viewed European settlers as useful in their broader fight to kill and enslave other Native Americans. Their aims were no better or worse than those of many Europeans."

By the time, Columbus set foot off the mainland coast, scores of native American nations had been entirely wiped out by one another, scores more tortured/raped, displacement was a way of life from conquering, etc. Columbus and company were essentially novices in comparison. Additionally, it was the Native Americans who broke the majority of the treaties initially. The favor was returned once the Europeans became more powerful. 

"I really do not understand this justification to keep one in denial of the genocidal war the Whites did to the Amer. Indians which were the first ones who discovered America."

There is no justification. There is perspective, however. And since it can be concluded the entire world was doing this at the time (with the Native Americans being (on the whole) worse offenders)... the claim of mean whitey bullying the peaceful natives is dismissed as revisionist bs, is all. 

"While it may be true the Indians were not peaceful towards each other, they did not murder each other in the massive numbers the whites did to them and they did not force relocate other tribes by making them walk for hundreds of miles letting many die during the journey of The Trail of Tears."

They did exactly that. Many tribes were already wiped out entirely. There was constant fighting for land and resources. They didn't have a Trial of Tears because they usually annihilated their foes down to the last child. And if they were lucky, they were able to retreat after getting kicked off their land from a fellow tribe. 

"I'll take Biden over Trump on the common sense grounds that Biden may be ineffectual, but Trump is an active menace. If that's 'ideological' to you, so be it. To me it's simply 'logical'."

So in your opinion... an "active menace" led to the better aforementioned results (poverty, housing, wages, prices gas/groceries, border security, no Russian expansion, etc).... but ineffectual is preferred? How is that "common sense/logical" when its actually contrary?


"If you truly believe that Republican economic policy has been the true-blue buddy of the working class for the past 40+ years, I really don't know what to say to you. You'll have been so deeply indoctrinated that there'd be no hope of ever showing you which end is up."

Not Republican but conservative. When the GOP went along with the progressive policies, we hurt as a result. We do know the Reagan's economy was superior to Carters and Trumps was superior to both Obama and Bidens. Clintons was built on a tech bubble he has nothing to do with and a progressive housing bubble lending guidelines that led to the 2007/2008 crash. Its not when the hits occur, but the policies that brought them. Since you conceded Trump's was better but your ideology dictated dementia Biden with worsening conditions and pivoted to another losing argument, its clear your barriers were indeed ideological and not intellectual. 

There had been numerous books written about this historical fact, and they used to be in libraries.

Of course these books have been getting burned since the seventies. How will they burn the link you brought up? There are people on this board who will make it their life's work to destroy it, though, which is the real "book burning" and rewriting of History that goes on. 

Like you say, the reality is that every single "so called civilization" before the twentieth century was brutal and inhumane and nationalistic.

And like you say, there are too many people who can't abide this reality, and we see that here on this board from the ignorant masses. They will do whatever they can to burn the books that don't kowtow to their narrow minded narratives. Thus, we know who has actually been "burning books" in the world.

Much appreciated. :  )

I have loved studying history whether it be the Roman Empire, Feudal Japan, the foundation of the US, etc. I find it all so compelling and interesting.

I do not claim history is pretty or should be whitewashed... but perspective is key. Many here are not interested in an objective approach to challenge their narratives... but to beat the drums of their ideological perspective. Heck, I used to far different than I am now with regards to my politics. And in 2016, I was a strong never-Trumper. I never understood how people could lie to themselves when it still ultimately made them miserable. 

He was gay, Gary Cooper?