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Post by abbey1227 on Nov 16, 2024 15:29:43 GMT
It's what they've been taught. How best to be a victim at all times.
I think fundamentally it's not so much about victimhood but rather about being conditioned to believe that the entire history of humanity is nothing but a power struggle of variously defined identity groups.
Jordan Peterson discussed this. Academia has been instructing everyone in terms of oppressor/oppressed. And the real value is in being the victim. At all times.
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Post by furor teutonicus on Nov 16, 2024 15:31:39 GMT
The belief in one, all-powerful, and merciful God who is the creator and sustainer of the universe. Edit: For all three.
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Post by scream on Nov 16, 2024 15:36:49 GMT
It’s the same for all three. Control over people. Mostly women. In all three. I don't usually engage with you but you can't be THAT ignorant. Do you seriously believe that a religious belief of any other part of a culture, for that matter, forms as a conspiracy? Spoken like a true believer in just one specific religion. I studied comparative religion in college and saw, in all religions, the same basic model for control of others by discouraging critical thinking skills, substituting faith - a belief in something for which there is no evidence - for the realistically based model that we as humans are on our own, no 'savior' is going to make things okay, if not now, but in an afterlife for which there is also no evidence. But if we all follow the rules and restrictions, we will be 'saved'. Very comforting delusion. "The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one. The happiness of credulity is a cheap and dangerous quality of happiness, and by no means a necessity of life." George Bernard Shaw And this thread should really be on the RFS board, but since religion and politics seems to have joined forces in the control department...
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Post by papamihel on Nov 16, 2024 15:38:42 GMT
They're all kinda the same purpose, primitive man's attempt at explaining the universe I kinda resent the "primitive" part. Even Ancient Mesopotamia had a very complex culture. But essentially yes. Religion is partly a way to explain the universe and also (and probably more importantly) a handy replacement for the evolutionary proses of genetic programming - something that allows to condition people to survive and thrive in their society.
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Post by papamihel on Nov 16, 2024 15:41:21 GMT
I think fundamentally it's not so much about victimhood but rather about being conditioned to believe that the entire history of humanity is nothing but a power struggle of variously defined identity groups.
Jordan Peterson discussed this. Academia has been instructing everyone in terms of oppressor/oppressed. And the real value is in being the victim. At all times.
Not that it started in academia. I think academia is simply a natural refuge of people who subscribe to unworkable ideas because there they are not required to put them into practice.
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Post by abbey1227 on Nov 16, 2024 15:43:36 GMT
Jordan Peterson discussed this. Academia has been instructing everyone in terms of oppressor/oppressed. And the real value is in being the victim. At all times.
Not that it started in academia. I think academia is simply a natural refuge of people who subscribe to unworkable ideas because there they are not required to put them into practice.
It's the downfall of Western culture going on.
Where we used to raise children to become self-reliant adults..........now they're instructed on how to be as dependent as can be.
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Post by papamihel on Nov 16, 2024 16:01:52 GMT
Not that it started in academia. I think academia is simply a natural refuge of people who subscribe to unworkable ideas because there they are not required to put them into practice.
It's the downfall of Western culture going on.
I think these are two separate processes. The complete separation of academia from reality happened decades before the conditions for the downfall of the advanced humanity (and yes, that is mostly the West but not exclusively) had all come together. The political side the academia supports and enables is not the cause of the downfall. But it greatly benefits from it and instinctively ensures it continues. However, I do believe the reasons are objective and it might be inevitable. At least, I have no earthly idea how it could be stopped.
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Post by Olaf Plunket on Nov 16, 2024 16:29:08 GMT
What do you think is the main idea of... Let's start with an easy one. What do you think is the main idea of Judaism, Christianity, Islam? Each one separately, of course... Religion is the storehouse of something better understood as "tradition." Over the vast extent of history the world and traditions have changed. At the dawn of civilization there was a sort of "tradition" of animal sacrifice. It did not seem so cruel to many people because animals in the wild are cruel to each other. Later as life became much more settled and kids became attached to their pets the idea of animal sacrifice lost favor. It no longer served any purpose. It is no longer a tradition. At first gender roles developed for various reasons that seemed practical. The gender roles of animals in nature sometimes follow patterns similar to those early humans followed. Again as the world became more civilized the need for hunter-gatherers and child sitters changed. In the uncivilized world when disputes arose it was practical to appoint authority in that matter to some person or other. In the civilized world something understood as "reason" is given authority. Over time it became apparent that males and females have an equal capacity for reason. Modern Christianity does two things in this regard. It still has a "tie breaker" for those rare instances when a couple cannot reach an agreement through reason. It is important to understand that is only a tie breaker so that a house will not be divided. A "house divided" is not a good thing. The other thing modern Christianity does is recognize the capacity of women to contribute to the determination of preferred policy. 1 Peter 3:7 says, "Husbands, in the same way, live with your wives in an understanding way, showing honor to the woman as the weaker vessel, since they are heirs with you of the grace of life, so that your prayers may not be hindered." I suppose some people will find the terminology "weaker vessel" is not completely accurate, nevertheless there is the reasonable consideration of the interests of women. Science fails when it tries to settle matters that can only be settled by tradition. When people had to cross a large stream it was not unusual to consult tradition. How did people before us get across? Science can offer the choice "build a bridge" that might well be practical in the circumstances. Still there are quite large numbers of problems that science is utterly useless to solve. Then it is necessary to consult traditions that still seem sound. The "left" is in a state of shock now because they believed and still believe religion is the problem. Religion is not the problem, stupid people are the problem.
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Post by shadrack on Nov 16, 2024 16:33:51 GMT
I'll go: Judaism - God made covenant with Abraham, and by performing a set of specific actions you can become one of the chosen Christianity - God has a very personal relationship with every human Islam - everything is controlled by God and it is one's duty to make sure all humans submit to His will Christianity - Salvation through belief in the resurrection of Jesus.
Mostly agree on Judaism and Islam, but...
Judaism - Not sure I agree about the "becoming one of the chosen" part. The covenant is between God and his chosen people who are kind of a fixed set -- i.e. descendants of the original 12 tribes. While it's possible for an outsider to convert to Judaism, conversion is not a core idea, as far as I know.
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Post by general313 on Nov 16, 2024 16:38:16 GMT
They all promise you that the next life is going to be better than the current one. Acceptance of this argument is an excellent filter for selecting a compliant flock, willing to endure hardship for a reward after death, give money to the church, vote Republican, and be more likely to go for questionable real estate transactions.
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Post by primethefirst on Nov 16, 2024 16:43:54 GMT
Religions were originally linked to specific cultures and heritages and natural phenomenon like the seasons. The Bible is about spreading a centralized influence to different cultures, sort of like the Borg.
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Post by cat on Nov 16, 2024 16:45:51 GMT
In order: chosen people, martyrdom, submission to God.
To all: social control.
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Post by cat on Nov 16, 2024 16:49:48 GMT
It's what they've been taught. How best to be a victim at all times.
I think fundamentally it's not so much about victimhood but rather about being conditioned to believe that the entire history of humanity is nothing but a power struggle of variously defined identity groups. Every religion is going to be translated through the filter of its local context and environment. In the case of each religion, the culture around which they evolved came first. Consider local traditions and culture as the hand on the wheel.
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Post by abbey1227 on Nov 16, 2024 16:53:23 GMT
They all promise you that the next life is going to be better than the current one. Acceptance of this argument is an excellent filter for selecting a compliant flock, willing to endure hardship for a reward after death, give money to the church, vote Republican, and be more likely to go for questionable real estate transactions.
What does informing everyone "This is it!" gain you? It doesn't seem to motivate people towards the better, imo.
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Post by general313 on Nov 16, 2024 16:58:04 GMT
They all promise you that the next life is going to be better than the current one. Acceptance of this argument is an excellent filter for selecting a compliant flock, willing to endure hardship for a reward after death, give money to the church, vote Republican, and be more likely to go for questionable real estate transactions.
What does informing everyone "This is it!" gain you? It doesn't seem to motivate people towards the better, imo. If you're okay with fake promises, go for it. And the history of warfare in Christian and Muslim nations doesn't indicate a motivation toward the better either.
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